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Danio Id
June 3, 2011
6:57 pm
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mikev
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Would anyone kindly try to ID these chaps?

[Image Can Not Be Found]

These were bought over the internet as Danio sp.Hikari /angry.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":angry:" border="0" alt="angry.gif" /> by me and also by another person (who is about the top fish expert in the US). We are both certain that the fish has nothing to do with Hikari, but then we disagree on what they are.

Thanks!

June 3, 2011
7:21 pm
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andy rushworth
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If they are not Hikari , then they will most likely be D. kerri /thumbs_up.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumbsup:" border="0" alt="thumbs_up.gif" /> Kerri is a beautiful fish , it originates from Thailand Hikari and Kerri look very similar but apparently are different ! Hikari is a Burmese fish .

June 3, 2011
7:56 pm
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Matt
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Agreed Andy, looks like one of the southern populations of D. kerri judging by the yellowish base body colour. /thumbs_up.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumbsup:" border="0" alt="thumbs_up.gif" />

Cake or death?
June 3, 2011
8:11 pm
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mikev
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thank you guys,

(D.kerry was also the guess of my expert friend, I thought they are a strain of D.albolineatus... some of them do have a similar blue line toward the tail.)

they are definitely not Hikari's... besides the color/pattern difference, Hikari's (I have them too now) have much better developed barbels and a deeper body.

They are, incidentally, the easiest danio to breed yet...No work involved, I'm simply siphoning fry from the substrate (unlike d.rerio and others fry that is not free-swimming hides in the substrate and not on the glass).

June 3, 2011
8:31 pm
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Matt
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Hmm Mike, how is the body colouration in life?

Cake or death?
June 3, 2011
10:01 pm
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mikev
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Sorry?

The colors on the photo are about what I see (and, yes, D.roseus was also suggested, but clearly not).

June 3, 2011
11:29 pm
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Matt
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I was asking if the colours in the photos are representative of the live fish because if a purplish background colour was apparent in life they may have been the form of D. albolineatus from the northern part of Peninsular Malaysia which was once described as D. tweedei (currently synonymous with D. albolineatus), and you'd mentioned a certain similarity with that species. As I'm sure you know photos can sometimes distort colouration, though obviously not in this case so thanks for clarifying. Hadn't considered D. roseus for a second. /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

Cake or death?
June 4, 2011
2:24 am
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mikev
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D.tweedei (the photo from danios.info specifically) was the basis for my thinking that they are a variation of D.albolineatus exactly... I have these guys in two tanks, with light and dark substrate, and the coloration is identical in both.

I just discovered that your profile talks about confusing the two... this makes me feel better /biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" />

June 4, 2011
3:00 pm
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andy rushworth
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Personally I'd stick with Kerri , the colouration looks right ,plus the body markings /thumbs_up.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumbsup:" border="0" alt="thumbs_up.gif" /> .

June 10, 2011
7:04 pm
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mikev
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Sharper photos from the vendor's ad here.. albeit the colors are different a bit... maybe this will confirm the diagnosis.

I made a breeding experiment yesterday...gravel sac into a spare empty 10g, then examine the bottom and collect eyelashes. 25. /biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" />

June 10, 2011
7:30 pm
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andy rushworth
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Hi Milev , personally I'll stick with Kerri !

Hikari has a more prominent striping in the caudal than Kerri , both beautiful aquarium fish though /thumbs_up.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumbsup:" border="0" alt="thumbs_up.gif" /> .

June 10, 2011
9:47 pm
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mikev
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Thanks, Andy, case closed now.

(I have real D.sp.Hikari too... so that these are not was never in doubt, but I never saw a D.Kerri in my life, they don't seem to be available in the US lately. Yep, both are beautiful.)

June 12, 2011
8:28 pm
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Stefan
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I've been discussing this thread with Peter Cottle and he allowed me to post his answer on it:

QUOTE
They are without doubt IMO sp. hikari. I know the seller very well and we have looked at those fish in some detail. I have no doubts at all they are sp. hikari.

June 12, 2011
11:02 pm
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mikev
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Peter is The Expert, and the seller (Dennis Ball) is very serious about danios, but here are a one immediate reason why this are not Hikari's:

With Hikari's the defining characteristics is different coloration of sexes... in fact Hikari Yellow and Blue are still sold differently. I can sex my Hikari's instantly, without thinking about the shape. These chaps are actually difficult to sex as danios go, and color is not of help.

(Funny enough when I got the fish from Dennis, I asked him to try to give me roughly even sex ratio... he replied he cannot sex them unless he sees who chases whom...)

June 13, 2011
9:29 am
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andy rushworth
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Ok , would it be fair to say that if these are sp Hikari the one's in the pic are all males ?

Perhaps a few more pics might help /thumbs_up.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumbsup:" border="0" alt="thumbs_up.gif" />

June 13, 2011
11:32 am
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Matt
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I believe there's a theory that sp. 'hikari' may turn out to be a colourful form of D. kerri should genetic tests be performed.

Agree that clearer photos, especially of the caudal peduncle and caudal fin, would help.

Cake or death?
June 13, 2011
3:23 pm
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mikev
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Then I have a whole bunch of males, since the color is similar on all... and some of my males produce fertile eggs too. /biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" />

Vendor's photos (link above) are fairly sharp and show the tail clearly. I'll try but photo'ng these fast moving things is too difficult...

If these are indeed D.Kerri's, I doubt they are closely related to D.sp.Hikari... it is not just coloration, barbels are more developed with D.sp.Hikari.

June 13, 2011
4:10 pm
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andy rushworth
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Its an interesting topic this ! the fact that Pete Cottle thinks that they are sp Hikari is interesting because he's pretty damn good on Danio's /thumbs_up.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumbsup:" border="0" alt="thumbs_up.gif" />

The colour differences between the sexes in Hikari are similar in Kerri to a lesser extent ,Milev I suppose once your fish have been fully conditioned you will be able to differentiate the sexes easier /huh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":huh:" border="0" alt="huh.gif" />

Milev when you said the case was closed it looks to have opened itself again /laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="Laugh" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" />

June 13, 2011
5:27 pm
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mikev
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Mine are conditioned all right... I had the original group for a year, and bred them to get a few more for a rivertank...both groups are adult and in good shape. Whether the color difference between sexes exists is not clear, but if yes, it will be very subtle...

OK,here is one more ID twist. My friend Frank runs an importing business, and imports various fish, has danios most of the time, for many years. He was here a week ago (to swap some fish /biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" />) , and made the following comment: "I had these imported once a few years ago...very nice...don't know what they are but absolutely not Kerry." (and obviously not Hikari, who live on the same shelf).

(My handicap is that I never kept Kerry's and never saw them in person...they simply don't seem to be sold in the US lately. If I ever see them, I'll get a group just to compare...)

June 13, 2011
5:46 pm
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andy rushworth
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There is a fine example of a D.Kerri here in the Knowledge Base , I'd say female ?

Hi Milev I don't doubt the condition of your fish ,I didn't realise you'd had them so long /laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="Laugh" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" />

Well I'd have said Kerri , now I'm confused , Pete Cottle thinks sp/ Hikari and your friend thinks neither /wacko.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":wacko:" border="0" alt="wacko.gif" />

Clearer pics and a visit from either Nonn ,Kamphol or Plateen would be interesting /blink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":blink:" border="0" alt="blink.gif" />

I'm assuming they are wild /pure ?

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