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Death Tank!
April 16, 2009
10:58 am
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Kit117033
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It's confirmed - I officially own a tank of death! /blink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":blink:" border="0" alt="blink.gif" />

Three more female guppies & one Oto died over the Easter period (sadly none of them resurrected /sad.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad.gif" /> ) Now treating with Pimafix & Melafix so that my shrimp can stay in the tank.

Water check didn't show up anything untoward (ammo 0 Nitrite 0 Nitrate 40 PH 8) normal readings! Didn't think there would be a problem as my shrimp are still alive & well, I've heard they are like the "canary" of the tank & will not tolerate high levels of ammo, nitrite or nitrate!

20% water changes every week now!

Another female guppy looking dodgy! (why is it all females? I used to have a good balance of male/female ratio- but now it's 4 males/ 5 females!!! I can't risk putting any more fish in at the mo)

On a slightly better note I found one guppy fry in the tank & put it in the breeding net with some fake plant for cover. I hope it's a female & it survives! /tongue.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tongue.gif" />

I think if they all die I'm giving up on fish & just sticking to shrimp!!!!!!! /ohmy.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":o" border="0" alt="ohmy.gif" />

Kit

April 16, 2009
12:12 pm
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David Marshall
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Hey Kit

These things, sadly, happen sometimes with the aquarium fish hobby.

Don't give up on the fish that easily as they are well worth the effort and I am sure things will go right in the near future? You may have to strip down the aquarium and start again but give it a go.

We had our first 'proper' tropical freshwater tank going for a month when the heater went crazy in the night and 'boiled the lot'. Another time a Severum, even though well fed, tried to swallow a heater and took with it some beautiful Synodontis and a huge Short-nosed clown characin.

These things can happen to us all.

Regards David

April 16, 2009
6:58 pm
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Kit117033
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QUOTE (David Marshall @ Apr 16 2009, 12:55 PM) < {POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hey Kit

These things, sadly, happen sometimes with the aquarium fish hobby.

Don't give up on the fish that easily as they are well worth the effort and I am sure things will go right in the near future? You may have to strip down the aquarium and start again but give it a go.

Regards David

Thanks for the kind words & I probably will keep at it /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /> I know I keep threatening to replace them all with plastic fish! /tongue.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tongue.gif" /> But there's something about these little fish that attracts me to them - they are so playful - following your finger pressed against the tank /biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" /> I'm totally hooked! I lose many hours of the day just standing in front of the tank & watching them play!

Sadly the death toll rises - lost another female today /sad.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad.gif" /> my last female from my original fry. So now I have 4 male/ 4female left. She had "haemorrhaging" on both sides & was resting on top of the filter partly out of water - I moved her to a "floating hospital" (a tub suspended in the tank) that's when I noticed the red patches on her sides. She died several hours later. /sad.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad.gif" />

I believe that she was the mother of the fry I found 2 days earlier.

I have invested in a copy of "A-Z of tropical fish" by Burgess, Bailey & Exell and am currently reading it from cover to cover to see if it enlightens me!

Kit x

April 16, 2009
11:10 pm
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Matt
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Hi Kit many of the guppies on sale these days are of horrendous quality and often succumb to disease. I would suggest trying to find a good quality local breeder before replacing the ones you've lost. Otos are not very easy to keep imo and do best in a mature, well-planted tank plus a pH of 8 is a little high for them. It sounds like you have the right attitude if you've bought a book and a few months from now you'll probably wonder what all the stress was about. /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

Cake or death?
April 16, 2009
11:50 pm
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Reva
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Hi Kit, I am so sorry that this is happening to you, as I know how bad it feels. I agree with Matt in that I have seen that some of the pretty guppy strains are really delicate. Have you tried adding a bit of salt and upping the temperature? Sometimes pregnant guppies cannot stand the strain of transport, and will die from giving birth prematurely. If you buy more, try for females that do not look pregnant. The same is true of Mollies. But Platys are really tough and very pretty and have live babies. In your place i would add Platys and keep the tank warmer than you have by a couple of degrees. Good luck!

April 17, 2009
4:24 pm
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Eyrie
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I wouldn't add salt without knowing what other species are in the tank. This could cause probelms for any softwater fish present.

Mature, sensible signature required for responsible position. Good prospects for the right candidate. Apply within.
April 17, 2009
4:32 pm
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Kit117033
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Hi Matt & Reva

It's nice to hear from you both.

I did research many local FS before deciding on buying fish. I chose "Maidenhead Aquatics" because their tanks were clean, the owner & staff seemed knowledgeable, there were no dead fish in the tanks & they quickly quarantined any tanks that the fish showed signs of illness. Their prices were a little more expensive - but I would rather pay more for a fish kept in good conditions! The staff seemed very adept at catching the fish without causing too much stress to the fish or it's remaining tankmates! /thumbs_up.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumbsup:" border="0" alt="thumbs_up.gif" />

In response to Reva (Have you tried adding a bit of salt and upping the temperature?) I have added aquarium salt to make brackish water for them - but apparently the oto's shouldn't be in salted water according to "www.otocinclus.com" - maybe that's why one of them died! The other seems fine though. I tried raising the temp from 25ºc to 26ºc but the fish became very listless so I put it back to 25ºc & they are back to frolicking around /rolleyes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":rolleyes:" border="0" alt="rolleyes.gif" />

I think I need to do more research on oto's before I put any more in. I just hope mine doesn't get too lonely on it's own while it's waiting!

Some good advice on buying female guppies that are not pregnant, thanks. Unfortunately the three pregnant guppies that died were all from my original stock of fry - not the new fish! But I will bear it in mind when/if I buy any more fish.

Thanks once again for all the advice, this site is fantastic! /thumbs_up.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumbsup:" border="0" alt="thumbs_up.gif" />

Kit x

April 17, 2009
4:49 pm
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Kit117033
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QUOTE (Eyrie @ Apr 17 2009, 05:07 PM) < {POST_SNAPBACK}>
I wouldn't add salt without knowing what other species are in the tank. This could cause probelms for any softwater fish present.

Hi Eyrie

I think I have found this out the hard way I'm afraid!

I currently have 4male guppies, 4female guppies (not ideal ratio I know but I did have 9females to start with & have lost 5 of them!) one Oto remaining out of three I bought, one upside-down catfish I never see, one sucking loach (SAE or CAE not sure which!) one neon tetra (all that was left when I inherited the tank) & 3 Amano shrimp (2male & 1female)

Three weeks after adding the salt one of my oto's died (I have since read on http://www.otocinclus.com that they don't like brackish water! OOOOOPS!) The other one seems ok at the moment though, so maybe they can cope with it!

Very new to this tropical malarky - have had a coldwater tank with shubunkins in for many years with absolutely no problems! Thought that tropical would be just as easy - how wrong can a person be!!!! /blush.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":blush:" border="0" alt="blush.gif" /> But still I persevere! /biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" />

April 20, 2009
6:18 am
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Reva
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Yes , sorry about the oto...I didnt realize you had those too. Salt is toxic to plecos, but a tonic to fish that come from semi brackish conditions , which many livebearers are from. Some people have a hard time with guppies. It isnt the first time I have heard this story, which is a mystery, but it happens. Usually these same people find joy with platys /rolleyes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":rolleyes:" border="0" alt="rolleyes.gif" />

April 20, 2009
8:35 am
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Kit117033
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QUOTE (Reva @ Apr 20 2009, 07:01 AM) < {POST_SNAPBACK}>
Yes , sorry about the oto...I didnt realize you had those too. Salt is toxic to plecos, but a tonic to fish that come from semi brackish conditions , which many livebearers are from. Some people have a hard time with guppies. It isnt the first time I have heard this story, which is a mystery, but it happens. Usually these same people find joy with platys /rolleyes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":rolleyes:" border="0" alt="rolleyes.gif" />

Hi Reva

I've done another 20% water change at the weekend but didn't add any salt to the new water this time! The one remaining oto still seems fine - busy eating! He/she seems a bit lonely on its own but I'm unsure how long to wait before I put any more fish into this aquarium given all the recent problems I've had! I would like to add some more otos & some more shrimp (cherries I think this time)

On a better note - I've had no more deaths since 16th April touch wood! (whoo hoo 4 days & counting) hope I haven't just jinxed myself LOL /blink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":blink:" border="0" alt="blink.gif" />

I think I may try some Platys & see how I go (stupid question but will my guppies try to mate with the platys? they are randy little buggers!) /blush.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":blush:" border="0" alt="blush.gif" />

Take care x

Kit

April 20, 2009
10:21 am
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David Marshall
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Hey Kit

Glad that things are getting better in the Guppy tank. You have worked so hard to 'save your friends'.

It is possible for a PlatyxGuppy cross but I have never seen such a fish. However Guppies cross easily with Mollies. Fish breeders in the Far East produced commercial quantities of GuppyxMollies in the mid-1980's but, thankfully, their appearance in the U.K. did not last long as the males proved to be infertile. For the record these fish had Black Molly bodies, head area of a Guppy and beautiful flowing fins.

Regards David

April 23, 2009
6:07 pm
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Reva
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echoing David here.... I have never seen guppies cross with platys, but platys and swordtails will cross , as well as guppies and mollies. But they will stick with thier own species if they have them. You have to deprive a male of his own kind of female before he will go for cross breeding.

Although I have seen some swordtail males that were so naughty they would try any fish with a fat tummy...LOL /laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="Laugh" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" />

April 27, 2009
4:07 pm
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Kit117033
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Oh dear - it's happened again /wacko.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":wacko:" border="0" alt="wacko.gif" />

This time I've lost a male guppy (my beautiful blue) no preceding symptoms, just found dead on the gravel this morning (the clean up crew had already started on him!) /sad.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad.gif" />

Thought I'd got to the bottom of all this - what with no deaths for nearly two weeks - then this happens!

Still on the up side, it makes the male/female ratio slightly better! /tongue.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tongue.gif" /> Now left with 3males/4females!

*sigh*

April 27, 2009
6:55 pm
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Richy
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Hi Kit, Sorry to hear you've had another death but all i can reccomend for now is, ride out the storm for a while, monitor all fish as you have been doing and don't add anymore livestock and keep up with regular weekly gravelvac/water changes /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /> It will subside and settle in due course i hope /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />
Keep your chin up Kit /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

April 27, 2009
8:16 pm
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Kit117033
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QUOTE (Richy @ Apr 27 2009, 07:38 PM) < {POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hi Kit, Sorry to hear you've had another death but all i can reccomend for now is, ride out the storm for a while, monitor all fish as you have been doing and don't add anymore livestock and keep up with regular weekly gravelvac/water changes /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /> It will subside and settle in due course i hope /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />
Keep your chin up Kit /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

Thanks Richy

I'm going to leave it for a while until I get a long period of no deaths (either the prob will be sorted or all the guppies died) Then I'm going to get some Platys & possibly Sailfin Mollies & 3 cherry shrimp /biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" />

Any ideas on how many I can have in my tank: ELITE STYLE 60 Measures 60 x 30 x 35cm high, it contains a fake plant & two ornaments for hiding places.

I already have a sucking loach (3") an upside down catfish (2") a neon tetra (1") an Oto (1") three Amano shrimp (1") seven remaining guppies (all approx 1" bodies not inc tail)

Kit x

April 27, 2009
10:24 pm
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Matt
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This thread should be retitled "Sodding farm-bred guppies". /laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="Laugh" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" />

Might as well cause a few more problems for you then. Kit pet your tank isn't really big enough for sailfin mollies and that "sucking loach" is going to be a real problem later on if it's one of these:

[Image Can Not Be Found]

I'd seriously consider getting shut of it if so and maybe trying to find a decent local breeder if you want more livebearers. You'll be amazed at the difference in quality of the fish. /wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" />

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[Image Can Not Be Found]

Cake or death?
April 27, 2009
10:39 pm
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dunc
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Speaking of which - where do people recommend local to Whitley Bay? My mate's after some decent quality livebearers, specifically Guppies I guess.

April 28, 2009
8:33 am
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Kit117033
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QUOTE (Matt @ Apr 27 2009, 11:07 PM) < {POST_SNAPBACK}>
This thread should be retitled "Sodding farm-bred guppies". /laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="Laugh" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" />

Might as well cause a few more problems for you then. Kit pet your tank isn't really big enough for sailfin mollies and that "sucking loach" is going to be a real problem later on if it's one of these:

[Image Can Not Be Found]

I'd seriously consider getting shut of it if so and maybe trying to find a decent local breeder if you want more livebearers. You'll be amazed at the difference in quality of the fish. /wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" />

Hi Matt

I believe the loach is a Gyrinocheilus aymonieri - blonde version! He's a bit territorial about his "house" that he lives in (although he does share it with the upside down catfish with no probs) he rarely comes out, only to eat, then darts back in /tongue.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tongue.gif" /> he hasn't caused any probs with the other tankmates (except chasing the guppies away from his algae wafer - but he doesn't go after them) I must admit that he originally came from my goldfish tank (I bought two of them) but he kept harassing the other loach & wouldn't let it feed - so I put him in the tropical tank about 2yrs ago.

The LFS I use now is "Maidenhead Aquatics" in Havant - they seem to be very good - well kept tanks with healthy looking stock.

I guess it's just the guppies themselves! My other fish seem unaffected by all this malarkey /tongue.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tongue.gif" />

I won't get the Sailfin mollies if you think my tank isn't big enough, it wouldn't be fair to them. So how many platys should I get given my tank dimensions & existing stock (minus one more female guppy as of this morning /angry.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":angry:" border="0" alt="angry.gif" /> who was perfectly happy swimming around when I fed them but was dead on the bottom 10mins later!)

Thanks for the continued support & advice from you all

Kit x

April 28, 2009
11:00 am
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Matt
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QUOTE (dunc @ Apr 27 2009, 10:22 PM) < {POST_SNAPBACK}>
Speaking of which - where do people recommend local to Whitley Bay? My mate's after some decent quality livebearers, specifically Guppies I guess.

Don't know if Keith still breeds guppies and stuff but for sure he'll know someone good mate.

Kit you can probably add 4 or 5 platies but unless you want fry everywhere I'd recommend buying all of one sex. /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

Cake or death?
April 28, 2009
12:28 pm
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Kit117033
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QUOTE (Matt @ Apr 28 2009, 11:43 AM) < {POST_SNAPBACK}>
Don't know if Keith still breeds guppies and stuff but for sure he'll know someone good mate.

Does anyone know any good livebearer breeders in the Havant/Waterlooville area?

(Matt you are welcome to move this particular question to a new thread if appropriate /biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" /> )

QUOTE (Matt @ Apr 28 2009, 11:43 AM) < {POST_SNAPBACK}>
Kit you can probably add 4 or 5 platies but unless you want fry everywhere I'd recommend buying all of one sex. /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

I don't think the fry will be a problem - have had guppies since October & only seen three drops of fry! Only found 1 solitary fry in the last three months /wacko.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":wacko:" border="0" alt="wacko.gif" /> I guess my other tank occupants deal with the extra! /blush.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":blush:" border="0" alt="blush.gif" />

Kit x

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