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Male Apistogramma panduro
April 6, 2011
6:31 pm
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JazzBora150
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hi
ive noticed for sometime now that my male apistogramma panduro is hanging in the water and clamped up
he does swim about freely but generally just hangs
he does seem to be flicking gill plate on surfaces to clear an irritation

im thinking he maybe has gill flukes but surely this would spread to rest of tank
but this appears to not be the case as this has been ongoing and no other fish showing same symtoms
he is however doing damage to his gill plate while trying to rid the irritation

can anyone suggest anything else and a medication to solve issue

i used to keep koi but all the medicines we use for koi are not suitable for tropicals

thanks

martin

April 8, 2011
1:51 pm
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JazzBora150
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would it be wise to add tonic salt?

and has anyone got an idea of how much salt to add

April 8, 2011
3:01 pm
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Colin
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don't medicate until you knwo what you are treating for... first off, pH???

April 8, 2011
5:13 pm
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JazzBora150
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NO3=0
NO2=0
GH=16
KH=3
pH=7.6
Cl2=0

if these help

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April 8, 2011
8:20 pm
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Colin
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yes...

pH should be somewhere about 5 and GH about 1 for a softwater acidophilic fish like this to do well. I kept and bred mine between pH 4 and 5

Time to lower the pH

cheers

April 9, 2011
12:02 am
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JazzBora150
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is lowering the ph going to suit the rest of the tankmates though
i will have to look into this
find it odd that its only the male whos affected not doubting your input but the female is always as bright as a button

ill check all the ranges for all fish tomorrow

thx martin

April 9, 2011
6:15 pm
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JazzBora150
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would i be correct in saying that a simple ph down product will only work short term as the water will buffer itself back up and that all i will end up doing is putting more chemicals into my tank. ive also concluded today that i want to bring my ph down to 6
im aware this is the top end for my apistogrammas but its the bottom end for the majority of my fish

how can i swing the ph so that it is stable as this is most important to fish health

anyone suggest good products for this

current tap water ph=7.8

April 11, 2011
1:59 pm
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JazzBora150
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at what rate is it acceptable to lower the ph value

ie from 7.8 to 6 in how long ?

April 11, 2011
2:09 pm
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JazzBora150
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again i refer to my koi keeping days
i have used vinegar to lower ph in the past
just added until desired level is reached
can the same be used in tropical fish keeping?

April 11, 2011
5:08 pm
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Colin
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I use phosphoric acid 81% from hyrdoponics guys on eBay

I would NOT add it directly to a tank with fish in it though, perhaps a series of water changes over a couple of weeks would be better /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

April 14, 2011
2:47 pm
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JazzBora150
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been slowly dropping the ph but ive stopped now as i dont think its the problem

danio rerio still dying lost 2 since last post

and another looks likely and the A. panduro looking no better still hanging in water nose down most of the time

more suggestions needed /sad.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad.gif" />

April 15, 2011
6:07 pm
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JazzBora150
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i have now noticed that the water has buffered the ph back to where i started

now what option do i have

is RO the next option? how easy is it to use? i think i recall somewhere that its to pure to use on its own so a mix is required
this is something i know absolutely nothing about and worries me a bit as it will be an expense to get it

or i could get rid of the A. panduro and save myself a lot of problems (dont like defeat though)

open to suggestions

April 15, 2011
6:10 pm
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JazzBora150
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i have now noticed that the water has buffered the ph back to where i started

now what option do i have

is RO the next option? how easy is it to use? i think i recall somewhere that its to pure to use on its own so a mix is required
this is something i know absolutely nothing about and worries me a bit as it will be an expense to get it

or i could get rid of the A. panduro and save myself a lot of problems (dont like defeat though)

open to suggestions

April 15, 2011
7:16 pm
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Bluedave
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You've lost a few fish recently haven't you mate?

How about back to basics - was the tank fully cycled before adding fish? Do you carry out regular water changes? Is there anything that could have affected the filter etc? Whats the temperature of the water?

What have you got in the tank in terms of substrate, plants, decor etc?

I'm not sure playing with water chemistry is the way forward, think there must be an underlying problem somewhere.

April 16, 2011
11:40 am
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JazzBora150
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yes tank was cycled
water changes done every sunday
i dont think that there is anything that could of affected filter i only clean half filter at a time
water temp 25c
substrate is betta aquarium gravel
plants only 2 plants 1 amazon sword and 1 green cabomba
rocks holy rock i think its called
wood i large and 1 small bogwood
and thats about it really

thanks dave hope this gives you an idea

martin

April 16, 2011
7:23 pm
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JazzBora150
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as a process of elimination i have removed the rocks as i seem to recall someone had suggested that they were not a great choice
i also removed some fish too
so over the next week i will monitor the situation to see if it has any affect on the ph

April 17, 2011
5:54 am
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Bluedave
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your NO3 of 0 is interesting - there should be some NO3. What about ammonia? Have you tested for this?

When did you set the tank up, how big is it (dimensions not volume) and what fish have you/did you have in there? When did you lose the last fish? Have you got any full tank shots, some times helps people spot something obvious!

How do you clean the filter?

All more questions I'm afraid mate but hopefully we can get some answers!

April 19, 2011
6:37 pm
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JazzBora150
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no3 = 0
no2 = 0
nh3/nh4 = higher than 0 lower than .25
ph = 8 !!!!!!!
gh = 16
kh = 3
cl2 = 0

only ph is different. it appears to be higher when the rocks taken out
tank has been set up now for about 5 months

dimensions of tank 31"x13"x18" juwel rio 125

2x fluval 303
air pump feeding 2 stones
temp 25 - 26
water change once a week about 25-30%

last fish to die was last week a danio

i removed all remaining danio and 2 ancistrus

fish in tank at minute

not going to do the latin coz it really takes me a lot of time finding them

3 dwarf neon gourami
2 honey gourami
10 black neon tetras
6 emporor tetras
2 clown loach
2 A. panduro
2 kribensis
1 cupid cichlid
6 corydoras sterbai
2 corydoras aneas (albino)
3 red eye tetras
1 german ram balloon strain
2 ancistrus
2 black widow tetras

all the fish are small the biggest is neon gourami at about 2 1/2"

if ive missed out any info let me know

ammonia is a little higher than normal but i did a filter clean last night
i usually clean a filter every week as i have 2 externals i thought this was the best way to do it
substrate is cleaned once a month

thx for all your help

martin

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April 19, 2011
7:54 pm
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Senor Bastardo
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Firstly what type of test are you using?

Secondly, your tank is really overstocked and you should consider upgrading or getting rid of fish.

April 19, 2011
8:17 pm
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JazzBora150
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i know its overstocked i have a new tank coming 72x18x24 i am still gathering up all the kit i need to install it and the base is yet to be constructed
i am also over filtered with the 2 large fluval 303 external filters
one of which is just filled with kaldness k1 media
2 test kits used
gh and kh are tested with a tetra kit
the rest are tested with an api freshwater master kit

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