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First Aid Help ?

Home Forums Fresh and Brackish Water Fishes First Aid Help ?

This topic contains 26 replies, has 2 voices, and was last updated by  thelizzious 9 years, 3 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 27 total)
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  • #312548

    David Marshall
    Participant

    Hey

    As we talked about in the previous thread I think that the change from pond to aquaria, and the increae in care you have so lovingly bestowed upon the ‘new’ fish, has brought forth bacterial/protozoan problems.

    Lizz first thing I would do was move ‘Hala’ to a holding vessel on her own because, if I am right, ‘she’ may carry symptoms to your established fish population?

    The symptoms you describe are similar to those that pond fish can suffer from when making the ‘jump’ from winter to spring temperatures.

    Lizzy this description is from the ‘Sera guide’ named ‘How to keep your ornamental fish healthy’:-

    ‘Carp pox, which usually occur in spring with Koi, are caused by viruses. This is not true pox, and cannot be transmitted to humans, but is a herpes disease.

    Round or oval-shaped pale or pink elevations, measuring between 5 and 10mm, appear on the body surface of the infected fish. Sometimes several months pass between infection and the outbreak of the disease. The fish do not seem to suffer very much even when heavily infested. Keep your fish in optimum condition and, gradually, the skin heals.

    Nevertheless,, the disease is still latently remnant in the organism and breaks out every time the fish become weakened’.

    If any of the above does not make sense remember it was taken from the booklet.

    Lizzy I don’t know if you have Sera products available but they recommend a 5 day treatment with their product cyprinopur in a ‘normal’ dose while feeding, for up to 3 weeks, their product Koi Bacto tabs.

    I am convinced, without seeing the fish, that this is the most likely cause of the problem but there is also the smaller chance that TB could be the cause?

    To be on the complete safe side I would ask a local retailer with knowledge of pond fish to pay your ill fish a visit.

    Regards David

    #312549

    thelizzious
    Member

    Round or oval-shaped pale or pink elevations, measuring between 5 and 10mm, appear on the body surface of the infected fish. Sometimes several months pass between infection and the outbreak of the disease. The fish do not seem to suffer very much even when heavily infested. Keep your fish in optimum condition and, gradually, the skin heals.
    No need to question, David, you’re 100% correct.
    Does this mean I threw in my own windows because of my so called kindness? She still seems so healthy, coming alive and blossoming. And the only way out of my 120 l. tank is strait back into the unheated 80 l. tank. I just don’t want to risk my goldies, they are so important to me. This is really killing me. <img src="style_emoticons//wacko.gif” style=”vertical-align:middle” emoid=”:wacko:” border=”0″ alt=”wacko.gif” /> <img src="style_emoticons//sad.gif” style=”vertical-align:middle” emoid=”:(” border=”0″ alt=”sad.gif” /> <img src="style_emoticons//unsure.gif” style=”vertical-align:middle” emoid=”:unsure:” border=”0″ alt=”unsure.gif” />

    #312550

    David Marshall
    Participant

    Hey Lizzie

    These things do happen with fish.

    Sometimes you have to try your best to remedy the situation and then re-build around what you have left. You would be surprised how many tropical keepers loose a whole tank of fish to the ‘bacterial soup’ that is giving off, very quickly, when some of the ‘L’ number loricarins suddenly die and their bodies are unseen. As yet there is no known cure for this and no one from the scientific community has done any research on the subject to discover a cause (although, in a private conversation, a very well respected retailer told me that he believes that feeding prawn and mussel in excess to these fish is a root cause of both their demise and the subsequent bacterial soup).

    However with your goldfish you are working with a disease than can be cured. I would, if you have not done so already, move ‘Hala’ out of your established tank. Once done I would make a large water change and ‘hoover’ the gravel.

    If you have no Sera products available I am sure that your local retailer will find you a close alternative?

    I hope all goes well with both aquaria. Keep me informed of how you get along.

    Regards David

    #312551

    thelizzious
    Member

    That was quiet an experience and a very tough lesson to learn. <img src="style_emoticons//sad.gif” style=”vertical-align:middle” emoid=”:(” border=”0″ alt=”sad.gif” /> It took the whole day and part of last night to ponder about this pond-experience. (sorry, I just love word-games). I was very reluctant to taking Hala out of her new and better enviroment and throw her back into the sewerage, as I call the cold water tank. Though yesterdays water-refreshing (in the 80 l. tank) almost did the trick and the tank water almost looks clear now.
    I felt in-humane and nasty about putting back Hala to where she has been promoted from. Perhaps I should keep in mind that I feel that way and not the fish.
    Finally did it, but I had to “arm-wrestle” her back into the cold and dangerous water. They started chasing her immidiatly.
    I did a water change from 1/3 and threw in the last of my Easy-Life filter help into the buckets. My fish are pretty hardened because of my lack of knowledge, so I hope that might also be a help to get them through whatever lurks into the biological/chemical dark. I will buy the medicin you mentioned, David, tomorrow, when the stores open.
    The lesson in this is to never change a working enviroment, I guess. Lizzy played god and that was stupid. But as I write this I am also watching the cold tank and they’re not only chasing but also biting at her. They know she is ill, and I know it is natures law of the strongest. But I do not know if I am that strong. Because this is breakung my heart. And the only way out for het now is small plastic bucket…. Bet she ends up in there as a corpse anyhow, huh? Someone better send me some tissue’s (for me).
    Thanks for the lesson, though, David. Much appreciated. You’re absolutely right and I bow for your wisdom, Namasté. <img src="style_emoticons//wub.gif” style=”vertical-align:middle” emoid=”:wub:” border=”0″ alt=”wub.gif” />

    #312552

    David Marshall
    Participant

    Hey Lizzy

    You have no need to ‘bow to my wisdom’ I just wanted to help you and your fish.

    Regards David

    #312553

    thelizzious
    Member

    That’s just me being appreciative the Buddhist way.
    Btw, I killed the light (killed? a buddhist?) in the cold tank trying to ease the matters there a bit, because an hour ago I could have sworn I had piranhas in that tank instead of goldies.
    God help me if one of my established fish gets ill, because I have no back up tank that large. I have to fix that, soon.

    #312558

    David Marshall
    Participant

    Hey Lizzy

    Hope the medication works. Keep me informed of progress.

    Regards David

    #312582

    thelizzious
    Member

    Hala made it through the night at one piece. All though I was ho;ding my breath when I saw her almost bend double and very quietly under the filter. She didn’t move at all, not even when I putted back on the light. I didn’t have the courage to try if she would respond if moved. So I fed the fish their usually pond grains and what would you say…Hala came from her yoga mat and not a scub or scale was moved. She ate with the others and they’re leaving her at peace now.
    Something strange I discovered this morning, when I saw Hala’s body, yesterday her wounds were all thick and yellowish, that is gone now, is all flat and gone back to pink again. Which proves it was the water and other surroundings changes that got her sick. I hope I say all this correct because sometimes I don’t even now the “fisherman’s latin” in Dutch, let stand alone in English.

    #312598

    David Marshall
    Participant

    Lizzy

    For the sake of your established community you did right to remove Hala – glad she is okay.

    Regards David

    #312701

    thelizzious
    Member

    Hello, David. As promised an update about Hala and the other goldies. Whilst Hala is recuperating very well and has been accepted in her tank after 4 days of constant chasing after her, I had the scare of my life when I found white dot’s on the fins and tails of my own goldies. It began on one of the fins and the tail of my youngest black moor. I know they show dots like that when they’re ready for mating/pairing. So I just sat there and observed. Two days later the pots began to show on her body, greyish, not real white, more blurred. Then the older black moor showed them too and three days ago my queen, the orange veiltail showed dots on her tail too. They’re not ill, they’re eating and playing, always with their noses in the gravel. But I got worried and went to the petshop store and asked for a medicin I could use in case it was Ich or Carp-pox. She had no idea what Carp-pox was, even not after I told her the whole story about the Hala-experience. But to be on the safe side she adviced me to use a drug called EXIT tm. It’s dark green and I had to use 20 drops per 100 liter first and then four three days 10 drops per 100 liter.
    I did that the last three days in my 120 l. tank and now I am trying to do the same in the 80 l. tank where Hala lives.
    So far all goes well. No new spots or dots. The only problem is that I am experiencing a very mild breathlessness (I am asthmatic), it’s like you just sneezed and cried for a while and I can taste it in the back of my throat.
    Another question, you said about the tank-fish adjusting to the water in my tank from the water of the pond. what if they finaly have adjusted to cleaner water and later on need to set out in ponds again? Wouldn’t that trigger the same effect on the goldies of the 80 l. tank? I am just asking because I found somebody who is willing to take over the pond-fish in the spring.

    #312718

    David Marshall
    Participant

    Hey Lizzy

    Glad to hear that Hala is doing well and that the retail outlet were able to be of such good help.

    Once fish have Carp pox it never fully goes away. You will have to warn the person taking the fish but tell them not to worry as it could be that the problem will not arise in the larger surroundings of the pond?

    Some advice on re-housing the pond fish:-

    1. Wait until the weather is warm and at a time when the surface water of the pond is roughly equal to that of their holding aquaria.

    2. For a fortnight or so before release visit the pond and bring home jam jars full of water. Slowly mix the water from the jars with that of the holding aquaria. Watch for reactions.

    3. 4 days before the release is planned stop feeding the fish.

    4. On release day take with you some cheap plastic washing-up bowls. Place the fish into these, in their own water, and then gradually add water, over a good hour (unless the fish are distressed), from the pond.

    5. When temperature in bowls is roughly equal to the surface temperature of the water then release the fish.

    I hope all goes well.

    I was interested to hear of your reaction to the chemical. The same happens to me with certain brands of fish foods.

    Regards David

    #312722

    thelizzious
    Member

    Talking about chemicals, the 80 l. tank had a hood from some cheap kind of wood (I can’t identify it) with a very small TL ligt of 15 watt in it. My dad made this for my sister, because the tank she had, had no hood on it. Here I always use the filters with as outlet soft running water, just to make sure the water keeps moving. The hood got wet and it must have had some chemical reaction, because I got coughing all the time and my “pondies” kept being restless and apathic all the time. A few days ago I removed the hood and putted a daylight (pink) TL behind the tank. Gone is my coughing and the fish are so much more alive and I would almost say they are starting to have fun in that overcrowded 80 l. tank.
    Thanks so much for the precious tips to re-house the “pondies”, David. I will keep that in mind. In fact, I will use it in my (written) aqua-journal. Much appreciated. <img src="style_emoticons//wub.gif” style=”vertical-align:middle” emoid=”:wub:” border=”0″ alt=”wub.gif” />

    #312733

    David Marshall
    Participant

    Hey Lizzie

    Keep us informed of how things go.

    Regards David

    #312829

    thelizzious
    Member

    Hello David. I am taking Hala out of the 80 l. tank. Her tank-mates keep harassing her, they even are nibling at her and she is not improving at all. So I am taking an “all or nothing” chance here by putting her in a very small tank, from 35x20x25 cm. I have filled it with 3/4 of water from the 80 l. tank (the pond-water) and I added 1/4 clean water with the addition of some Exit-drops. If I am not mistaking it was 20 drops to 100 liter, I have added 5 drops into the baby-tank Hala is in now.
    Okay, she has been in there for an hour and much to my (happy) surprise her back-fin is already standing upright and she is moving about (as far as that’s possible in such a small space), her colors are getting back too. I don’t know if she is gonna recover from this, but at least she can rest. I have a small filter in and a very small but not adjustable heater. My final goal is to get her healthy and put her in the 120 l. tank with my established 6.
    One more thing, I have closely watched the pondies for almost a week and there are no wounds on them at all, they seem just fine.
    If you have any suggestions, please, be very welcome.
    With love and light, Lizzy

    #312835

    David Marshall
    Participant

    Hey Lizzie

    You are doing fine and ‘Hala’ is going to be one very pampered fish. Please give her a few weeks, just to make sure that she is free of sores, on her own before adding to your community.

    Daft question from your news of the pondies but do you think that the medication did a good job and did you suffer any more health problems from this medication?

    Regards David

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