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Trying to Save Hillstream Loaches (Gastromyzon spp.)

Home Forums My Aquarium Trying to Save Hillstream Loaches (Gastromyzon spp.)

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 47 total)
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  • #353174

    aquariumhobbyist
    Participant

    @mikev said:
    Metro is NOT an antibiotic, it is a (weak) antiprotozoan med.

    Fish Disease Diagnosis: Anti-protozoan, Hole in the head disease (hexamita), chilodonella (body slime), freshwater ich, malawi bloat (internal hexamita), epistylis in pond fish.

    The good news is that since it has no bacterial action it is safe for the fish and for the biofilter, but it is not likely to do any good either.

    Ampicillin: this one is antibiotic, but a very old one and not effective against most pathogenic bacteria in fish. It is not impossible that once in a blue moon it is effective against something… heck, I had success with erythromycin one time! … but one should not play with even ineffective antibiotics unless there is some evidence it is the right thing to do.

    Import of medications: most countries limit import of antibiotics, but the two meds I mentioned are not, so likely you can get them. If you cannot get flubendazole, consider using fenbendazole (or another med in the same family) or levamisole.

    Thanks! Will try to look for them. My search for medications here are limited to pharmacies tbh, as there are not that many vets around.

    There is a commercial fish food medication “sera bactotabs” that has something in it but I cannot be sure if it is the right one.

     

     

    #353175

    aquariumhobbyist
    Participant

    Just wanted to give an update; the fish (except the one that died after the sales clerk tormented it on the shop floor) are all alive. Some are lighter than others (perhaps they are of different species because they have been like that since the tank became established?) but they are fairly small little buggers. They have begun to eat algae wafers as well as flake foods sometimes.

    They are doing well with the panda cories that actually help them by nibbling the wafers and breaking them into pieces that the gastro’s then nibble on as well.

     

    I also added Ceratopteris Cornuta that seems to be removing excess nutrients from the water.

    #353183

    aquariumhobbyist
    Participant

    Sad news: another gastromyzon died. I am not sure why. I just found the half eaten remains.

     

    What do these guys eat in the wild. I read algae so I placed a couple algae covered rocks in there. A couple I saw make a move to some algae wafers.

     

    Anything else?

    #353184

    mikev
    Participant

    Unfortunately, this is how it is with hillstreams: they may die at any time without any obvious causes and new fish is more likely to die. OTOH, they may live for many years too, toward 10 is possible.

    IMHO, food does not matter all that much. Preventative anti-parasite treatment has more effect on the survival rate.

    #353185

    Plaamoo
    Participant

    Gastros commonly arrive so emaciated that there’s no bringing them back. You also have quite a few, what size tank? In the future you might try 2 or 3 at a time until you get them established. I like to shave fine pieces off blocks of frozen bloodworms/mosquito larvae for my smaller fish and I have had some gastros take this. Did you get a handle on your cycle, ammonia/nitrites? Keep in mind whatever you feed will add to this problem so keep up the water changes.

    #353188

    mikev
    Participant

    Not just gastros. Remember our p.fangi experience?

    Other foods that may be of help are cyclopeeze and fry powder food — this is what I used to stabilize fangi’s. Take something like Sera Micron, put it into a cup with water, stir, then power on stones etc. And I suspect live food can be used in many cases, cf. my sewellia video. Another episode with emaciated fish I recently had was with Hara Hara….. I got eight, all looked very bad, I lost two but I think stabilized the rest. Artemia was helpful, they did not eat much of it, but that they ate some I believe made some difference.

    #353189

    aquariumhobbyist
    Participant

    Lost another 2 today. Both died at about the same time. Found them together, next to one another in fact, lying there. I would have thought they were just stuck on the glass next to one another if it hadn’t been for the extremely white underbelly of one.

     

    Water is clean; so low on nitrates what with all the floating plants that my light cycle has had cyanobacteria growth. trying to figure out how to get rid of it now. Is it possible these cyanobacteria (more so the toxins I read they release into the water) had anything to do with their deaths? I tried to manually remove some during my water change and the very next day 2 deaths…

    #353190

    mikev
    Participant

    Cyanobacteria: possible, not probable.

    Most likely a disease that came with the fish, the chances of parasites are very high. You really need to deworm new wild caught fish to eliminate the most common cause, and if the problem persists, then start making guesses.

    The other possibility — mentioned above too — is that the fish is too far gone by the stress/starvation of shipping so there is really little you can do. It may take a month for such fish to finally die. However, two deaths at once follow ing a death 3 days ago makes me think that you got an infection going on.

    #353191

    Plaamoo
    Participant

    Which species do you have? I’ve not had much luck keeping the spotted ones, g. scitulus/ctenocephalus alive for very long. They seem to be more fragile, at least in my conditions. I have g. zebrinus and g. ocellatus that I’ve had now for several years. I’ve also learned how to choose them from the shop. No visible spine! Plump and actively feeding. :)

    #353192

    mikev
    Participant

    Opposite experience on my end regarding species…. so I seriously doubt…. but the pattern of dying is too reminiscent of a parasite accumulating in the tank…either small worm like capillaria or (less likely) protozoa.

    #353193

    aquariumhobbyist
    Participant

    @mikev said:
    Opposite experience on my end regarding species…. so I seriously doubt…. but the pattern of dying is too reminiscent of a parasite accumulating in the tank…either small worm like capillaria or (less likely) protozoa.

    Well I tried buying a dewormer but the vet wouldn’t sell anything to me saying that he had nothing meant for fish. What medications (a couple of options would be good) are suitable for the capillaria or protozoa? I remember you saying metrodinazole was not very effective even against protozoa but that is all I have access to at the moment. I heard a form of levamisole (-HCl?) is used along with praziquantel for certain worm infestations? How I can find these I have no idea.

    #353194

    aquariumhobbyist
    Participant

    @plaamoo said:
    Which species do you have? I’ve not had much luck keeping the spotted ones, g. scitulus/ctenocephalus alive for very long. They seem to be more fragile, at least in my conditions. I have g. zebrinus and g. ocellatus that I’ve had now for several years. I’ve also learned how to choose them from the shop. No visible spine! Plump and actively feeding. :)

    Mine are the spotted ones sadly. Looks like a mixture of the two, some have unbroken light blue bars on the tails and some have broken ones.

    Sadly, I don’t have much of a chance to choose; they were a one time delivery to the shop and after their treatment, I won’t be buying from them again. It is interesting because they have a major wholesaler that sells to almost all the petshops in Istanbul, but normal people can’t enter (perhaps because they want to sell in bulk).

     

    #353195

    aquariumhobbyist
    Participant

    @mikev said:
    Opposite experience on my end regarding species…. so I seriously doubt…. but the pattern of dying is too reminiscent of a parasite accumulating in the tank…either small worm like capillaria or (less likely) protozoa.

    your message actually alarmed me right now; how likely are the chances that my panda cories (of which I made the mistake of putting together) are infected? Frown

    Any symptoms I should look out for?

    #353196

    aquariumhobbyist
    Participant

    Quick question: would albendazole work for the capillaria or protozoa? I can access this one easily.

    #353197

    mikev
    Participant

    Albendazole is effective against internal parasites and in fact nearly analogous to flubendazole I suggested before, the problem is that it is nearly unsoluble in water, so just putting med into tank water will not work. Dissolving by grinding the med into fine powder and then stirring in hot water may or may not work, you can try. If you succeeded you should see all the snails in the tank dead in 3-4 days, it kills snails the same way as worms.
    Much simpler albeit costlier would be to buy flubendazole (again: wormer plus, order from the UK, they ship worldwide).
    Minimal effect on protozoa.

    If is internal worms you are dealing with, corys will be wiped out too, but a bit later. If protozoa or something else — not certain.

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